Olga Natividad Martinez Lima English Transcription

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Today is June 29, 2023, my name is Amanda Ortiz and for my research project titled, “Puerto Rican Bomba Fashions: Consumption, Presentation and Meaning Making,” I will be interviewing Olga Natividad Martínez Lima. Thank you for being here Olga, it’s a pleasure to have you.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

A pleasure.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

The purpose of this study is to collect and document information from Puerto Rican Bomba participants about their experience with Bomba and the Bomba dress to understand the deeper meanings and uses of this dress. Let’s start with the demographic data questions, Olga, how old are you?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I am 66 years old.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿And where do you live currently?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Carolina, Puerto Rico

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿Have you always lived there?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Yes.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿What do you do for a living?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I am retired.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

What type of education did you complete and where did you complete it?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I have a bachelor’s degree in biology, a master’s degree in postsecondary management, a master’s degree in guidance and counseling, and have doctoral credit.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿From where?

Ola Natividad Martinez Lima

From the Interamerican University of Puerto Rico.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿What gender do you identify with?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Woman.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿How would you describe your sexuality?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Heterosexual.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Are you in a romantic relationship?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿Do you have children?

—- [ask mom que dice ella ahí]

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿Where is your family from?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, okay, my parents are Cuban and I was born in Cuba, but I came since I was 4 years old. My brother was born here.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

¿Where?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

In Carolina, well Santurce, to put it that way, but we have always lived in Carolina, first we lived in Country Club and now we are living in Villa Fontana. My brother has our family’s original house and I bought the house behind it in Villa Fontana. His is a ground floor, mine is a 2 story. My oldest nephew lives in Bayamón with his wife and children. My middle nephews live in Caguas with two little dogs who are their children, and my niece lives in Carolina, in Metrópolis she is the only one who stayed in Carolina, everyone left, but we have a very, very close relationship.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Talk to me about your family, how big is it?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

My original family was small, my dad, my mom, my brother and me. My mother died in 2021 of cancer and my father, forgive me, in 2001 of cancer, and my father in 2014. My brother is married, he had 3 children who are already married, the oldest is also the one who has two children. The others have not been able to have children. And I am the titi, grandmother, godmother and everything.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And do you have any physical disabilities?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No, mine is at the vascular level, a neurosm that I got in 2015.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And could you share your current household income?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Of retirement.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Do you have any religious or spiritual affiliation?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Catholic.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And what elements or characteristics connect you with your Puerto Rican identity?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The music, the food, I love going to Guabate, I’m not very, and I go to Luquillo, for the bacalaítos, because I’m not a big fan of fried foods. And I could tell you that…the way…to socialize. We are, we are very, I say I have a combination because the Cubans are also very, very prone to, but I who have grown up here, we are very prone to, we are kind and we are prone to help, due to the circumstances we are experiencing, well, unfortunately one gets a little self-conscious, but in essence, you can see it in the marathons, in the walks, maybe they don’t give, they don’t give as much money, but they are there in solidarity, solidarity is the word and that to me identifies me as Boricua too.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Has there been a moment where you have felt more or less sure of your Puerto Rican identity?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

All the time, I am Puerto Rican period.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

You have never felt less sure, no one has made you feel less sure.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Not at all, not at all, like I said, no one knows unless they see my passport or I say it.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

They don’t know.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I mean, my closest friends, who knew my parents, that, a very close relationship, that has a very close relationship with me, they know that part, if not, I am Puerto Rican, no one, no one questions it.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Very good. Now tell me a little about your participation in the Bomba, your experiences with the Bomba.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Okay, my experience in Bomba…first it is a genre that manifests passion, all kinds of emotions, passion, jealousy, betrayal…sadness, I mean, there is in, in that, in that dance, you can manifest everything according to how you move. Initially in elementary school we did an activity, later in high school we did a representation in a week of the, of the Puerto Ricanness of a baquine, baquine is a children’s funeral where what is played is Bomba. We did that representation, I studied at the Santa Teresita Academy on Loiza Street and we did that representation in that Puerto Rican week and that’s when I got more hooked, I knew what it was, I knew what it was.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

What year was this?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

That was in 75.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

How old were you?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

17, 18, my birthday is in December so that was, that was in November and, I was around 17 years old. From there then I just pointed out to you that after that, while I was at university, I took courses with Doña Beba Cepeda, there in Piñones at her academy. Their basic course at that time, I understand that now it extends a little longer, at that time the basic course lasted 6 months, 6 months.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And can you tell me what it was that, like you said, that made you, that caught your attention about Bomba?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, as I told you before, I mean, it is a genre whereh you can manifest passion, joy, sadness, confusion, I mean all, all, all the emotions, I mean how you move, how you move the, the, the, the skirt, the sound, I mean the sound of sadness is not the same as the sound of joy. That is why I tell you that everything manifests. All kinds of emotion.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And did you just dance or did you learn other things?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No, no, my thing was dancing. I am clumsy at playing instruments. Ah well, I can play the maracas, I can play the maracas.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And did you learn, you know how there are different regions of Bomba…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

They, they…the Cepeda, Cepeda’s academy covers the eastern area. Therefore, it includes Loíza. Ponce’s is similar, but it is different. But the one in which I have participated and promoted has been the one of the eastern area.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And now…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Loíza, it is Loíza.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And you took classes and gave presentations, tell me?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, there was a show and from then on, that was 76, 77, I dance at a popular level, you know, but it’s no longer a question of, what to participate in.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And tell me about, right, what you did on the tv channel…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Oh okay, in the presentation of Santa Teresita, our theater director, who was the one who put it together, had a good connection with channel 6, and so we took it to the channel. The baquiné, we took that presentation of the baquiné to the channel and, and a video was taken and it was later shown. It seems to me that it was broadcasted on November 19th on channel 6. I am trying to, although it has been many years, I’ve been trying to see if we can get that video. If I get it for you, well, I would have it, we would have it for us because the class president was the first one I contacted and she told me, “if you get it, we have to duplicate it because that would be the best,” because we don’t have anything and not even the yearbook has a photo of, of that presentation.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

When was the last time you participated in Bomba?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

That, that I practiced it, that I practiced it. Officially in, in high school and later when I took classes, we are talking, 76, 77. Every time there is a party, I dance Bomba y Plena, forget about it, la calle San Sebastian in, in La Perla.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And what do you wear when, right, when you are going to dance in those contexts?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, official Bomba clothing, no, no, but I try depending on where it is, well I try to wear something more or less that represents.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Like a skirt…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No skirt, no, those activities, no, no, you shouldn’t wear a skirt and even less a Bomba skirt.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Why?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Because of the number of people there and the heat, I mean, Bomba skirts are skirts to dance that genre, period. It’s not for you to go around vulvulating around. First, it is attractive and it is, and it is representative. And second, I mean, for you to go to a party, to La Perla, you are not going to go with a Bomba skirt, understand.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

But when you did your presentations, did you wear skirts?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Oh well of course, yes my mother and it was my mother who was the one who made, and my mother was the one who did everything for me because my mother sewed.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

But and it was like, the clothing was more traditional, what is seen as traditional, the white…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Definitely, in the baquiné, if I remember correctly, the shirt was white, but the skirt was blue, baby blue, because it’s not indigo blue or anything like that, it’s baby blue.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

The light one.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Baby blue is the one that is used, that is, because it is the traditional one, which is all white or there are some intervals where white can be combined with light blue. And if I remember correctly, it had flowers.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Oh like with a flower pattern.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

It was, it was, on the skirt, it had flowers with the, with the blue. I don’t remember if they were poppies. No, it was another type of flower, but I don’t remember which flower. It would be nice to see that video, because then one remembers many things, many things, especially the clothing.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And your mother only made the costumes for you or the group?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No no, no, no, no, no, my mother only sewed for me.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And how did she learn to make that type of costume?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, because she accompanied me to classes and Mrs. Elsa also showed her clothes because they have their clothes there at school, or they tell you where you can get them. So my mom bought the fabric. And I even went to the Imperio store and bought fabric, and then, since she already had the measurement for me, we would go to Tomas or to the Imperio store and I would buy the fabric then since she already had the measurement for me.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

She already knew how to do it.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Yes, exactly, in fact, she worked with Fernando Pena.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Do you still have does dresses?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No, between moving and moving. I don’t have them.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And right, when you put on the clothes or when they put on the skirt or nowadays when you dance with the clothes you have, what do you feel? How do you feel?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Happy, I mean, the rhythm enters your feet and you feel it, you have to feel it. When you hear the drum, if you don’t feel it, forget it, you’re not going anywhere, nothing is going to come out of you.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And no…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

And as if something got into your body, you understand what I mean.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And do you think what you’re wearing affects how you feel when you’re dancing, like…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The dress?

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Aha when you dance with the skirt, with the traditional costume…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Indistinctly, indistinctly. It even has evolved so much that there are short pants. I researched this at the Institute of Culture.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Can you tell me a little bit about that?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Of the shorts, I mean, some shorts and what sticks out is the blouse.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Is it a specific blouse?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

A blouse with, with the colors of, of, of, of evolution or the school it corresponds to.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

According to…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The school or who is dancing, I mean, you can wear a flowery blouse and you have all the colors. Maybe someone tells you, “ah, that’s representing the gay flag,” but it has nothing to do with it, it has nothing to do with it, it has no connection.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Do you buy those pants or do you make them?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

You can make it or you can buy it.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And do you know which, what year did it become more popular?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The research does not say.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

It is pretty modern though, right?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The cultural evolution….let me see.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, no problem.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

with singing, the music, complement the music….no, no it doesn’t say.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

No problem, we can infer it is pretty modern.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Yes, definitely, I don’t know a specific year, but within the evolution it must be, as the youth emerges, young people within the genre, within the genre it evolves and it, and, I mean it is, it integrates.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And have you done more research like this or did you do that for this interview?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No, I mean, from when, when I showed you, I communicated to you my interest in participating, I took on the task of investigating more about how it has evolved and if, and if, the genre, I mean, I know what happens on a daily basis, but when we agreed, I took on the task of investigating a little more and how it has evolved, that’s why I went directly to the Institute of Culture.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And the knowledge that you had before about clothing was through, the school of…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

It was from the school, that’s right, and even from the instruments too. About the instruments.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Of the instruments?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I mean, the drum, the cua, the [inaudible]. Everything was, that knowledge was acquired at the Cepeda school.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Because they teach you and tell you…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I mean, they, they talk to you about, before, before you start, before you start to execute, they tell you the meaning of each one of the instruments and clothing. It would be good if you visited the school.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, especially because they give you the meaning of the clothes, but they divide it up like the skirt, the scarf…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, sure, sure, sure. They tell you, and each one has a meaning, it’s not you put the dress on that way just because. I mean, each one has a meaning.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And do you remember some of those meanings?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Oh dang…

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

If it’s not right, I’ll do my homework…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait…the instruments…. the clothing… The traditional, the clothing, the traditional clothing is the white dresses for women, for women, and sometimes they are accentuated with colors recurrent like blue and red. The men wear colored shirts tied at the waist with ankle-length pants. Men sometimes adorn themselves with a straw Panama-style hats. While women leave their heads bare or with headwraps.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And that was from the Institute of Culture?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

That was, that was under the Institute of, I went directly to the Institute of Culture. And, then I also have the instruments.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And do you think your experience with Bomba clothing and your knowledge of Bomba clothing affects how you feel about your Puerto Rican identity?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Why?

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

There are people who have told me that it connects them to their culture, to their ancestors, but if it doesn’t affect you, then it doesn’t affect you.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

On the contrary, it strengthens your identity more, I mean in my, in my perception, I mean.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, yes.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

And since I am welcomed here, I mean, my, my, my knowledge of identity, the idiosyncrasy of being Puerto Rican, strengthens me more, and from and with definitely also in connection with the ancestors, I mean because it comes from Africa, directly. I mean, the blacks brought it and then the workers added to it. To then bring your lament and your complaint and your devotions to express your emotions.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, it still has that element of expression.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

That’s definitely key. That’s why I tell you if you don’t feel it. It’s not going to happen, it’s not happening.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And with your interactions with other people, right? What kind of information have you learned about clothing? With other people, I mean, you talked about your interaction with the Cepeda school, have you had other interactions where you have been able to learn?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

With the Ayala brothers. I go to Loiza a lot and to their activities.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Mhm you learned from them.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Yes, definitely because they have, they have another vision.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

What do you mean by another vision?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Let me explain. Cepeda has, has, like, like a school, but the Ayala brothers have what is genuine, what is native. In combination with the vejigantes, with the masks. And that is, that is more authentic. In the case of Cepeda, well, it’s more, it’s more individual, let’s put it like this.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes but equally educational.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

But, but definitely you, there you take, absorb knowledge and it’s refreshing and I mean, it’s very interesting, it’s very interesting.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

What types of messages do you think the Puerto Rican society promotes about Bomba?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Can you explain? Can you elaborate, I didn’t understand well.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Maybe as Puerto Ricans, in general, know the Bomba, how do they promote Bomba to others…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

As part of, as an entire genre. It’s our genre.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

I am asking because…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

The caveat is that in most towns in the Caribbean and Latin America there is Bomba. I mean, where a black person arrived, there is Bomba, but he acclimatized and differentiated himself in clothing and the instrument. I mean, the leathers here are not the same as those in Colombia. The reservation must be made. But the genre exists, but diversified and authenticated according to the country. So ours has very particular characteristics.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, they are unique to Puerto Rico.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

From here. They are unique from here. Maybe one of those factors occurs in Colombia. One of those emotions manifests itself in the Bomba. [inaudible] let’s put it, how they beat the drum, the dancer shows it and the drummer shows it, jealousy. understand?

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes, even the clothes are also similar, but the one from Puerto Rico… I have two, which I jumped here.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Well, but let me answer them.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Do you have any of the Bomba rhythms that, you know there is the Yuba, the…right, the Holandes, if you have any rhythm that you identify with? Or that you like to participate more than others, dance more than others?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

No.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

You like them all the same.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

All. Remember that I perfected it in a school where they teach you everything. Since I am not active, nor am I an artist. As long as I can play it, I dance, you understand, with what I know, and with what I am born with. You know what, be it the Oyuba, or the Oca, whatever, forget it, a lot of mixes there. Everyone mixes.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

And the last one I didn’t ask you because I felt like you were answering it, but I’m going to give you the opportunity to, to, to...

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

Answer it.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

What does Bomba mean to you?

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

I understand that it is a cultural expression of being Puerto Rican.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

That’s what Bomba means.

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

And I think that for those who are Puerto Rican and it is essential to our culture. And now a few years ago the plena joined together, and they make a complement.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Well, those were, those were all the questions. As for the video, when you have it…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

If I get it, if I get it, I’ll share it with you quickly.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Oh well yes, thank you for your response and thank you for sharing your knowledge and…

Olga Natividad Martinez Lima

At your service.

Amanda Ortiz Pellot

Yes and thank you for yout time, too.